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[96.60.249.169]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 00721157ae682-739716ecc6esm28227887b3.20.2025.09.21.10.02.17 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 21 Sep 2025 10:02:17 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Date: Sun, 21 Sep 2025 13:02:12 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [PATCH 3/3] host/rootfs: switch to systemd-udevd To: Alyssa Ross References: <20250913-udev-v1-0-eade4ab8f2b4@gmail.com> <20250913-udev-v1-3-eade4ab8f2b4@gmail.com> <87ikhesf86.fsf@alyssa.is> <3bc30fa7-3f40-4373-bb7a-1c9119d8b939@gmail.com> <87a52o5797.fsf@alyssa.is> Content-Language: en-US From: Demi Marie Obenour Autocrypt: addr=demiobenour@gmail.com; keydata= xsFNBFp+A0oBEADffj6anl9/BHhUSxGTICeVl2tob7hPDdhHNgPR4C8xlYt5q49yB+l2nipd aq+4Gk6FZfqC825TKl7eRpUjMriwle4r3R0ydSIGcy4M6eb0IcxmuPYfbWpr/si88QKgyGSV Z7GeNW1UnzTdhYHuFlk8dBSmB1fzhEYEk0RcJqg4AKoq6/3/UorR+FaSuVwT7rqzGrTlscnT DlPWgRzrQ3jssesI7sZLm82E3pJSgaUoCdCOlL7MMPCJwI8JpPlBedRpe9tfVyfu3euTPLPx wcV3L/cfWPGSL4PofBtB8NUU6QwYiQ9Hzx4xOyn67zW73/G0Q2vPPRst8LBDqlxLjbtx/WLR 6h3nBc3eyuZ+q62HS1pJ5EvUT1vjyJ1ySrqtUXWQ4XlZyoEFUfpJxJoN0A9HCxmHGVckzTRl 5FMWo8TCniHynNXsBtDQbabt7aNEOaAJdE7to0AH3T/Bvwzcp0ZJtBk0EM6YeMLtotUut7h2 Bkg1b//r6bTBswMBXVJ5H44Qf0+eKeUg7whSC9qpYOzzrm7+0r9F5u3qF8ZTx55TJc2g656C 9a1P1MYVysLvkLvS4H+crmxA/i08Tc1h+x9RRvqba4lSzZ6/Tmt60DPM5Sc4R0nSm9BBff0N m0bSNRS8InXdO1Aq3362QKX2NOwcL5YaStwODNyZUqF7izjK4QARAQABzTxEZW1pIE1hcmll IE9iZW5vdXIgKGxvdmVyIG9mIGNvZGluZykgPGRlbWlvYmVub3VyQGdtYWlsLmNvbT7CwXgE EwECACIFAlp+A0oCGwMGCwkIBwMCBhUIAgkKCwQWAgMBAh4BAheAAAoJELKItV//nCLBhr8Q AK/xrb4wyi71xII2hkFBpT59ObLN+32FQT7R3lbZRjVFjc6yMUjOb1H/hJVxx+yo5gsSj5LS 9AwggioUSrcUKldfA/PKKai2mzTlUDxTcF3vKx6iMXKA6AqwAw4B57ZEJoMM6egm57TV19kz PMc879NV2nc6+elaKl+/kbVeD3qvBuEwsTe2Do3HAAdrfUG/j9erwIk6gha/Hp9yZlCnPTX+ VK+xifQqt8RtMqS5R/S8z0msJMI/ajNU03kFjOpqrYziv6OZLJ5cuKb3bZU5aoaRQRDzkFIR 6aqtFLTohTo20QywXwRa39uFaOT/0YMpNyel0kdOszFOykTEGI2u+kja35g9TkH90kkBTG+a EWttIht0Hy6YFmwjcAxisSakBuHnHuMSOiyRQLu43ej2+mDWgItLZ48Mu0C3IG1seeQDjEYP tqvyZ6bGkf2Vj+L6wLoLLIhRZxQOedqArIk/Sb2SzQYuxN44IDRt+3ZcDqsPppoKcxSyd1Ny 2tpvjYJXlfKmOYLhTWs8nwlAlSHX/c/jz/ywwf7eSvGknToo1Y0VpRtoxMaKW1nvH0OeCSVJ itfRP7YbiRVc2aNqWPCSgtqHAuVraBRbAFLKh9d2rKFB3BmynTUpc1BQLJP8+D5oNyb8Ts4x Xd3iV/uD8JLGJfYZIR7oGWFLP4uZ3tkneDfYzsFNBFp+A0oBEAC9ynZI9LU+uJkMeEJeJyQ/ 8VFkCJQPQZEsIGzOTlPnwvVna0AS86n2Z+rK7R/usYs5iJCZ55/JISWd8xD57ue0eB47bcJv VqGlObI2DEG8TwaW0O0duRhDgzMEL4t1KdRAepIESBEA/iPpI4gfUbVEIEQuqdqQyO4GAe+M kD0Hy5JH/0qgFmbaSegNTdQg5iqYjRZ3ttiswalql1/iSyv1WYeC1OAs+2BLOAT2NEggSiVO txEfgewsQtCWi8H1SoirakIfo45Hz0tk/Ad9ZWh2PvOGt97Ka85o4TLJxgJJqGEnqcFUZnJJ riwoaRIS8N2C8/nEM53jb1sH0gYddMU3QxY7dYNLIUrRKQeNkF30dK7V6JRH7pleRlf+wQcN fRAIUrNlatj9TxwivQrKnC9aIFFHEy/0mAgtrQShcMRmMgVlRoOA5B8RTulRLCmkafvwuhs6 dCxN0GNAORIVVFxjx9Vn7OqYPgwiofZ6SbEl0hgPyWBQvE85klFLZLoj7p+joDY1XNQztmfA rnJ9x+YV4igjWImINAZSlmEcYtd+xy3Li/8oeYDAqrsnrOjb+WvGhCykJk4urBog2LNtcyCj kTs7F+WeXGUo0NDhbd3Z6AyFfqeF7uJ3D5hlpX2nI9no/ugPrrTVoVZAgrrnNz0iZG2DVx46 x913pVKHl5mlYQARAQABwsFfBBgBAgAJBQJafgNKAhsMAAoJELKItV//nCLBwNIP/AiIHE8b oIqReFQyaMzxq6lE4YZCZNj65B/nkDOvodSiwfwjjVVE2V3iEzxMHbgyTCGA67+Bo/d5aQGj gn0TPtsGzelyQHipaUzEyrsceUGWYoKXYyVWKEfyh0cDfnd9diAm3VeNqchtcMpoehETH8fr RHnJdBcjf112PzQSdKC6kqU0Q196c4Vp5HDOQfNiDnTf7gZSj0BraHOByy9LEDCLhQiCmr+2 E0rW4tBtDAn2HkT9uf32ZGqJCn1O+2uVfFhGu6vPE5qkqrbSE8TG+03H8ecU2q50zgHWPdHM OBvy3EhzfAh2VmOSTcRK+tSUe/u3wdLRDPwv/DTzGI36Kgky9MsDC5gpIwNbOJP2G/q1wT1o Gkw4IXfWv2ufWiXqJ+k7HEi2N1sree7Dy9KBCqb+ca1vFhYPDJfhP75I/VnzHVssZ/rYZ9+5 1yDoUABoNdJNSGUYl+Yh9Pw9pE3Kt4EFzUlFZWbE4xKL/NPno+z4J9aWemLLszcYz/u3XnbO vUSQHSrmfOzX3cV4yfmjM5lewgSstoxGyTx2M8enslgdXhPthZlDnTnOT+C+OTsh8+m5tos8 HQjaPM01MKBiAqdPgksm1wu2DrrwUi6ChRVTUBcj6+/9IJ81H2P2gJk3Ls3AVIxIffLoY34E +MYSfkEjBz0E8CLOcAw7JIwAaeBT In-Reply-To: <87a52o5797.fsf@alyssa.is> Content-Type: multipart/signed; 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boundary="------------0aRRIS6U0ARJK0dKDv3qpNe0"; protected-headers="v1" From: Demi Marie Obenour To: Alyssa Ross Cc: Spectrum OS Development Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PATCH 3/3] host/rootfs: switch to systemd-udevd References: <20250913-udev-v1-0-eade4ab8f2b4@gmail.com> <20250913-udev-v1-3-eade4ab8f2b4@gmail.com> <87ikhesf86.fsf@alyssa.is> <3bc30fa7-3f40-4373-bb7a-1c9119d8b939@gmail.com> <87a52o5797.fsf@alyssa.is> In-Reply-To: <87a52o5797.fsf@alyssa.is> Autocrypt-Gossip: addr=hi@alyssa.is; keydata= xsFNBFpSgoYBEAC4xkCYidG2JlRWulUkTWcx0pHFDf3oSbb6Q872Kb3iDChWgluNVz43hva1 3xfDo9foV0GoyfGl/ycSCkXX5hlQr7ir/5FN38E7H/yY6tH8+l68iDgIOcb1qY0OYaxyg+Lz WesfFQedrmwNTbF4L1BtWzrTR5PflDdhDo5VWSguHGJFSclchcr/6UmMb/gOUN+2ElBC2TE2 EKY099phZ6DJZ2aZCsclwKIdCpZzXlEmXPAeaH5om6xo90JYv5+sFji40R0Plqec3WC+jTxy lGca6IbPdOminuUF+GvsR86eVsgh/0XNK7/zus7gyc4PuMUA1rCoeHcWOBDPgmelgCQyJGXd /bXeKuUsGoge58uc7/YNvOh1vfpD3AaEMqAyXfmmUwBnIicml74+2eOpH3Oljfs01g+DhkOB MtpVSZSgaIDvP0WG6cbAxImoUasnmNxEDNskfVmI8bsajPW9bt4z5hiP5Q9G3vE0D5HcIFdM adOz81PpOwNiUXcjtYV1PWZQ56jbSTOf8EBvsB71WwB+XgVWcPzIlY8hAykiHIO87oV3o71U JTAn1Foj7mjSADnY0deleOmar/K5jrK3wvKKM1XlB7PXcGBdkorJC+cbxVsw0ADzMw0c7bVc wEE7OFvHjQiIK1lO+lb1cvGBBY3IZxjsjZdA/VsFHFdAeYlzNQARAQABzRpBbHlzc2EgUm9z cyA8aGlAYWx5c3NhLmlzPsLBlwQTAQgAQQIbAwULCQgHAgYVCAkKCwIEFgIDAQIeAQIXgAIZ ARYhBHVzVtd5u7iIdz5BXnNszfnvUb2XBQJoh9HmBQkOtoJgAAoJEHNszfnvUb2XFxAP/jF7 Rxuspytz7VwOA/y5WQe/FdPNRvyRUzj66ZzfuaG++md14LWcrvbb2hHLdS5ePdKoOaqC3xhK Ncy/5RVd4pD5N4AY7O5228JKDO8GGWEl3rupOCmYQL9P8GpsdGt2xkFqbu4HrFzMTzl6nvKN GtvhBSCkAW3v7wTwPf2rkjX8f+clmRZn4YLfojaBCT/ZFjmJkQSWZ+2rUZOxjgZgckLkplu8 LVILVdaHNLkOrxbKQLuuVyEkN+/YrshyJP4a7Z/Tnw+3eZcaLuLOxBHpWOAAgJZ8kL+V7BxK DlTywv/OOr0CoNi9zjH3VgRiJ1961K/DocjA50pWBilMUs4jGp9omhkAOwdNV2hi+Zj/GXaD kgvBlE313DGWzgW0RauL8j5/GULgphwm5UOHXb/5yM9pRw87kfQ/+zQuHpguoXSGkUv0kSID 88kUGlNxy1kkTsSYG2UTKLmLDPuUGOUDGaNUzD+J49MogSLTmvHUIYNs0jFmpLyhVoTtSi/I VQQpHyk9ucAZd2OLxChm3RBJhAbmGw3rhUxx6B8SHwcBcJDttGyYF2GZj9AYAGlU/Fm1Itoi NwJD0vQnSZ//25l+XJehpeeixsqydj00gksHWEFaIEgCYyC6JfmGS4HtuUcv76vc2vLCv5aH hJVHHKGs+kiKJ2+r7bCNwvW0doVePdByzjgEZyd/yxIKKwYBBAGXVQEFAQEHQCVxoiHOlsEo NDKGCbxg4nL3E1CV0MRQCU1hPowd77h3AwEIB8LBfAQYAQoAJgIbDBYhBHVzVtd5u7iIdz5B XnNszfnvUb2XBQJoh9HXBQkB4YUCAAoJEHNszfnvUb2XgvAP+gIIKR3KatmwuUcla1RN6tUc 0Ae9eqS1cbSEDj8a14fnvUHtlCEO5g4m2PvPn7L2o7047ppl5100+zGMocXWslnDFJJVeAOp xzlhZ48DFMxkZkjtLY2fRrj1tOtzrTRikV0/UsaVs9tMPMEsVu/FH0exMoNELcqEVUgcRRpd XYXC9zgDUcM4+JRH8hDOiC51JRvdkXcokAXphuCY3J996i8Ph+kg6xMqscePscvvltR68jcT HHDOiOQtzjJRKQ6BHUzYdIRixcq210sabfZGJVT+7BfHI5qiUwfoG3DXSJygviN3I/EfnSbD 6T0Ccv/G6wQPHO4Vyn+egrMOU/HUrCKuq/b0rYvI8pTtRWAxIHkFZoKVB8I8Rl8+riGiEUAh Ja0bU4iOg7vR5Bm8Gt/tR6KjClyBI5NN1M1haFgVXqZ3dsQDpBjivbDHbUsAXVsd00y0B4Ir 8muvII9eJOwbTyqcG9RJbflquPp+FPlgiy9pYj52PB0NwzLYqX0fOWU8IqQF3bWtdJIb4Zat XnfqYtJ/wCaJTU43N3+/TIdqNA4G3WbyRYsCnz/kkf1ARmxoq3r29dOl8OnNHEvB1+hBlNBk d+cLpsYdTxa63OpbNDpm/unX1sEpOYy04dL5Y8B1Xbh+rQFNySq4Ani2dl5N1OsrjgzZ+wkl k2wOTWzl7wFH --------------0aRRIS6U0ARJK0dKDv3qpNe0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------BbGTBQmdfleak9IL0t21w8DH" --------------BbGTBQmdfleak9IL0t21w8DH Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 9/21/25 08:18, Alyssa Ross wrote: > Demi Marie Obenour writes: >=20 >> On 9/19/25 10:12, Alyssa Ross wrote: >>> I'm pleasantly surprised by how straightforward this is (mostly)! >>> >>> Demi Marie Obenour writes: >>> >>>> The dependency on /dev/dri/card0 being present is eliminated, and >>>> whatever devices the user has are now picked up by the compositor. = New >>>> dependencies are added to ensure that udev coldplug has finished bef= ore >>>> any non-trivial services are started. systemd-udev-trigger.service = runs >>>> 'udevadm trigger' and has Before=3Dsysinit.target, so anything that = is not >>>> an early boot service can assume 'udevadm trigger' has run. >>> >>> If software is expected to integrate with udev to discover new device= s >>> at runtime, why do we need to introduce new dependencies? >> >> I believe 'udevadm trigger' is needed to process devices that are >> already plugged when systemd-udevd starts. Otherwise, they will >> never appear. >=20 > Right, I get why we need to run it, but why do we need to block other > services on it? systemd uses this ordering and libudev and/or libsystemd might rely on it. I don't know if it does, but I also don't want to risk problems. >>>> --- >>>> host/rootfs/Makefile | 17 ++-- >>>> host/rootfs/default.nix | 94 ++++++-----= ----------- >>>> host/rootfs/etc/init | 2 +- >>>> host/rootfs/etc/mdev.conf | 7 -- >>>> host/rootfs/etc/mdev/listen | 2 +- >>>> host/rootfs/etc/mdev/net/add | 1 + >>> >>> We probably ought to rename /etc/mdev=E2=80=A6 is there an idiomatic = place to >>> put these sorts of things with udev? >> >> /usr/lib/spectrum is the idiomatic place for this stuff. >=20 > Sounds good. Unfortunately it conflicts with the current build system, which assumes that /usr/lib only has kernel modules. I'll use /usr/libexec/spectrum for now. >>> Can we remove our own static-nodes implementation? >> >> Yes, and I think it was never needed anyway as >> the kernel populates devtmpfs automatically. >=20 > It doesn't create static nodes though! It's very annoying. That really stinks! --=20 Sincerely, Demi Marie Obenour (she/her/hers) --------------BbGTBQmdfleak9IL0t21w8DH Content-Type: application/pgp-keys; name="OpenPGP_0xB288B55FFF9C22C1.asc" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="OpenPGP_0xB288B55FFF9C22C1.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP public key Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable -----BEGIN PGP PUBLIC KEY BLOCK----- xsFNBFp+A0oBEADffj6anl9/BHhUSxGTICeVl2tob7hPDdhHNgPR4C8xlYt5q49y B+l2nipdaq+4Gk6FZfqC825TKl7eRpUjMriwle4r3R0ydSIGcy4M6eb0IcxmuPYf bWpr/si88QKgyGSVZ7GeNW1UnzTdhYHuFlk8dBSmB1fzhEYEk0RcJqg4AKoq6/3/ UorR+FaSuVwT7rqzGrTlscnTDlPWgRzrQ3jssesI7sZLm82E3pJSgaUoCdCOlL7M MPCJwI8JpPlBedRpe9tfVyfu3euTPLPxwcV3L/cfWPGSL4PofBtB8NUU6QwYiQ9H zx4xOyn67zW73/G0Q2vPPRst8LBDqlxLjbtx/WLR6h3nBc3eyuZ+q62HS1pJ5EvU T1vjyJ1ySrqtUXWQ4XlZyoEFUfpJxJoN0A9HCxmHGVckzTRl5FMWo8TCniHynNXs BtDQbabt7aNEOaAJdE7to0AH3T/Bvwzcp0ZJtBk0EM6YeMLtotUut7h2Bkg1b//r 6bTBswMBXVJ5H44Qf0+eKeUg7whSC9qpYOzzrm7+0r9F5u3qF8ZTx55TJc2g656C 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