From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.6 (2021-04-09) on atuin.qyliss.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.6 required=3.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2,SPF_HELO_NONE autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.6 Received: by atuin.qyliss.net (Postfix, from userid 496) id EE62B20AA7; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 14:24:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from atuin.qyliss.net (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by atuin.qyliss.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2C88209C2; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 14:24:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: by atuin.qyliss.net (Postfix, from userid 496) id 4B777209BC; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 14:24:22 +0000 (UTC) Received: from mail-lf1-f42.google.com (mail-lf1-f42.google.com [209.85.167.42]) by atuin.qyliss.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 28E94209BA for ; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 14:24:18 +0000 (UTC) Received: by mail-lf1-f42.google.com with SMTP id k37so6440731lfv.3 for ; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 06:24:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=0KkvRkwB+0ApRX1mNOG5PVcqiIKElpxTP9mYmO05jao=; b=IeFFOJ4HQUMJM3H5Sxjm0J0kUrSrXNq3ivSxM4wM93K3QdnZlFNIbtMG4lHeeezkJq XkBuTToYe1IVnvpkBgvtJknYyhOShu8kgQTdeVRhs5DZwey9S73fgavrZTrDsL3RBG8z 8uAy/htX7KSfwUTE6mix0BKZsWohu04onqzL/+z6TFZTbBY3ioRYC6HTKQTPkPmePnE6 uiksWSuK6egPFIdqCkbo40O5emJwmlP8KVYEi6knAqYfNKegrRbTUBdCk0coGfSFD5Ef s08VYv++JNg/QL3q8IHLdtV3iFQ/gc8SFMrCs2fMeBwMtcjbhTCewBcYOOw5FkBjKnWD g/SA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=0KkvRkwB+0ApRX1mNOG5PVcqiIKElpxTP9mYmO05jao=; b=eEbV31kvg1ycIX7nXqjPxpKSu9EyYb6IWIuOnVkEUvCVEqfG2SgB4eApjQfmUp1mlc AQwaiW26guwRnD6tSWw5u5eCYips42/ap6fdE+2oG8Varzrch4fSBM/VqP5ql02W3c7p 7jnm4X58jRebfr8SKZ1j29VHKdz13a+gidNUzCv/+31Up3WzEKqbdoD6IAmDXpuJZszU EU8vqhxbg3eRSmxvAuOyLbNVRKO5KjjTC4TM6Ewe+LhFe0vB4JlySNNafcHrhLywllN9 txlKNPlR2l85spaXRfe9HRY1uJSzfWxV1EnUGU5UYhH3cE7aAIWv4IIBaomi3QtMLtx0 OcQQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530JBVQ96mkDzxy9Tmg0k3NyzY5SqXt1/JkrYPa2mePIhD4TsDNI //jwSXuJcvpTXWWHzKTKv2TO9FSyMe/V2+q10dA= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyycO1Nhh62/u6d/dln8gTQyfRtGwEqSYEbbN4GArOcUvCtG5Lqpber/VcRDvtRnYCgz6qBcTzF9wGCETo3ApI= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:3e2a:: with SMTP id i42mr77422lfv.77.1636554257334; Wed, 10 Nov 2021 06:24:17 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <87ble2czx6.fsf@alyssa.is> <87lfcvn1ln.fsf@alyssa.is> <87bldrn0kh.fsf@alyssa.is> <20210309162556.ctiy3yfp7plkbdqs@x220.qyliss.net> <87o871tqqu.fsf@alyssa.is> <87bl2sp3p3.fsf@alyssa.is> In-Reply-To: <87bl2sp3p3.fsf@alyssa.is> From: Thomas Leonard Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 12:00:14 +0000 Message-ID: Subject: Re: New user getting started questions To: Alyssa Ross Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID-Hash: GX6AWJRP5ITDYJSU2NGCGAFUPVS3GWVQ X-Message-ID-Hash: GX6AWJRP5ITDYJSU2NGCGAFUPVS3GWVQ X-MailFrom: talex5@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-config-1; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: Michael Raskin <7c6f434c@mail.ru>, discuss@spectrum-os.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.4 Precedence: list List-Id: General high-level discussion about Spectrum Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Wed, 10 Nov 2021 at 12:59, Alyssa Ross wrote: > > Thomas Leonard writes: > > > On Wed, 3 Nov 2021 at 11:37, Alyssa Ross wrote: [...] > >> Also, I've been following some Qubes work recently, and it sounds like > >> they might be interested in doing X11 over Wayland in a way that > >> wouldn't need special compositor support (and the corresponding > >> potential for security bugs). It sounds like it would be a lot of wor= k > >> though, so we'll see=E2=80=A6 > > > > Isn't that what Sommelier and wayland-proxy-virtwl are both doing > > already though? There's no need for any X11 support in the host > > compositor with them. > > Oh I didn't realise that. So the host compositor doesn't have to > implement an X11 window manager and speak back to the Xserver, like it > does in a normal XWayland setup[1]? Correct; the proxy acts as the X11 window manager to Xwayland, and just talks plain Wayland to the host. In fact, I managed to work around several problems with Sway's built-in Xwayland integration by using the proxy instead, even on the host (see https://roscidus.com/blog/blog/2021/10/30/xwayland/#bonus-features). > [1]: https://wayland.freedesktop.org/docs/html/ch05.html#sect-X11-Applica= tion-Support-architecture --=20 talex5 (GitHub/Twitter) http://roscidus.com/blog/ GPG: 5DD5 8D70 899C 454A 966D 6A51 7513 3C8F 94F6 E0CC